What is a hacker ?

[ishkur88]

So in this day and age, there seems to be a misconception over what it really means to be a `hacker`. Allow me a few minutes of your time to fix this misconception... hopefully at least.

What a `hacker` is...

By its first definition back in the 1960's, a `hacker` was a person that pursued a hobby or interest with extreme vigor and learned everything they could about it, and all encompassing fields involving it. There are different types of `hackers`, but for the purposes of this, I'm going to cover `computer hackers`. These individuals live and breathe computers and software. Within the realm of `computer hackers` are people who specialize in certain areas... encryption, networking, etc. There is also a branch of `hackers` that will be discussed later. True `hackers` don't really do anything out of maliciousness, they explore and learn.

What a `hacker` is not...

The term `hacker` is often misused to describe another form of life out there; `crackers` or as I call them, assholes. These numerous individuals are what you tend to find on forums wanting to know 'how to hack [insert name of thing]'. I've seen it thousands of times on this very site. Their only intentions are destructive ones and their very existence lowers what it means to be a `hacker`.

What you can do to help `hackers`...

First and foremost, unless otherwise noted by someone far more adept with `hacking` calls you a hacker or something similar... you are not a `hacker`. Odds are in fact you are a subspecies of `crackers` known as a `script kiddy`. You can fix this though. Learn a skill, learn a programming language and master it. Learn the ins and outs of your operating system. Contribute to Open Source projects. etc.

Well, if you made it that far and learned anything, good. If not... well then those of us that learned something are better than you, now aren't we?

[Twisted420]

Haha, this is a nice addition to the site, Mass should sticky it. Its quite annoying to find so many people who have no idea between the two, when its such a simple thing...

Hackers: Intent on Learning & Exploring
Crackers: Malicious Jackasses with a hole in their ego they try fill by hurting others.

[ishkur88]

Pretty. Odd. You were one of the people I was trying to point out as not being a hacker.

[Twisted420]

o.0 I'm not a hacker, and that doesnt say i am one...though i am also not a "cracker"...

I just know what the difference is...though my only intent on computers is to explore and learn...i've just got this thing where i love to learn about computers, and technology period...

and being a script kiddie doesnt classify as a subspecies of a cracker, its a subspecies of hackers as well, and so i classify myself as a script kiddie who's slowly turning into a hacker...given a long time...

o, and ishkur, you shouldnt classify people when you know so little about them...im not quite sure what to call me personally, but ask mass, he knows me best out of everyone here...so mayb he would have the correct term...

[ishkur88]

I can think whatever I want about anyone I want, and the wonder of the Internet is that I can say it as well. A skiddy is always a skiddy, no matter what, so you're not going anywhere. As for the term to describe you... lemme think about that one for a bit.

[blindskater2846]

Pretty. Odd. You were one of the people I was trying to point out as not being a hacker.

lol. by the way i probably fit in as the cracker

[Twisted420]

Yay, well, i dont mind being a skiddy...you yourself as well as the rest of the universe is a skiddy when in comparison to someone better...so its not really plausible to think that your arent :)

and blindskater...please dont try to laugh, when you are much, much worse than me :)

[blindskater2846]

true. i dont even try any more. i dont think i have the mind capacity.

[slowz]

I have the same view as Iskur. To me a hacker is one that uses a program, Desides it could use a new function and adds it. ( hacked the code ).

A skiddie is a pain i my ass like, having to disabling some usefull php and mysql functions for the fact they exploit them. and locking down a box to where i all but useless. I use to spend hours locking down a box. now thanks to my ( text based programing ) :D. its down to mins.

If i was to point out a few skiddies on this site im sure i would make a few people mad.

[ishkur88]

I know what I am, and I know my limitations. I am a programmer. More specifically I code C/C++/C# and PHP. I have a base in Ruby on Rails and a working knowledge of ColdFusion (I coded it professionally for a while).

As sl0wz was kind enough to extend my definition, I agree with him. Example in place: I had an application I was using a few months ago. It plotted coordinates from algebraic expressions. It lacked something I wanted to do (It could only plot graphs for 3 functions, I needed 4 to be done). So, I added the ability to run 4 expressions. I emailed the developers my code and hopefully they'll use it.

It's not a matter of comparison, who's better at what, what you're not good at, etc. It's a matter of what you're willing to put into something: time, effort, blood sweat and tears.

If you "dont mind being a skiddy" [sic], then that's your problem.

[Twisted420]

Well, I in fact do mind being a skiddy(under your definition of it, anyway)...which is why i've been teaching myself VB6(reading books mostly, as i'm too poor to afford a computer...[poverty sucks], but when I am on a computer, pretty much the only thing I do is teach myself vb...)/some php...

This is what i start in the fall of this year:http://www.pct.edu/catalog/majors/bwd.shtml
And okay, I guess I have to retract my earlier statement and say that you are right, it's not a matter of comparison.

Also, that story just puts lots of questions in my head...

[ishkur88]

Questions? Such as ?

EDIT: also, there is nothing they can teach you in college (technology related at least) that you can't find with a Google search. MIT makes that even easier with OpenCourseWare. But... if for some reason you still need some fancy piece of paper saying you 'know' how to program and that you 'know' how to set up a IPv6 network... then I guess college is something you need.

[Twisted420]

I was under the impression going to college for it would be the easiest way to actually get a job...a lot of good jobs require you to have b.s. degrees and such, but if by thinking this i am living in ignorance, enlighten me as to a better course of action :)

And just noob questions such as:
I dont know much about programming yet, so im not quite sure how this works...but in order to make an addon for something...or to mod it...dont you need to be able to ADD to their code? meaning you would have to use the same var's and such?(That was my original assumption...[I know this is not true, what i am asking, is how do you do it then?])

[slowz]

I was under the impression going to college for it would be the easiest way to actually get a job...a lot of good jobs require you to have b.s. degrees and such, but if by thinking this i am living in ignorance, enlighten me as to a better course of action :)

And just noob questions such as:
I dont know much about programming yet, so im not quite sure how this works...but in order to make an addon for something...or to mod it...dont you need to be able to ADD to their code? meaning you would have to use the same var's and such?(That was my original assumption...[I know this is not true, what i am asking, is how do you do it then?])

You dont have to have there code to build addon's, you can build addon's with the API if they release it.

[Twisted420]

I dun really get that :) So im gonna go use to google to figure it the hell out...

[blindskater2846]

i beleive im lower then a script kiddie but i decided to fuck it. ill just stick to skateboarding and guitar

[ishkur88]

The program I modified is called Lybniz. It does what I mentioned earlier, and it's coded in Python. The my addition was really nothing more than copy and pasting a method used already in the program to another spot and renaming it. (used to be 3 instances of this method, now there are 4 in my copy). The only reason I was allowed to do that, or even able to, was the fact that the program was Open Source (Google for that if you don't know what it is, the explanation is too long to fit in one forum thread).

As for the education thing.

The only field I can think of, other than automotive / construction work perhaps, that really doesn't `need` a degree is programming. Colleges offer courses in programming, sure, but you don't need to take it to survive in the real world.

Anything you can learn in a college classroom you can learn just as easily by yourself at home, for free.

http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/web/home/home/index.htm

One of the best resources I can give you is OpenCourseWare @ MIT.

@blindskater2846 - Even skaters and guitar players can code... ;)

[Twisted420]

Haha, I know exactly what open source is, im not that ignorant ;)

And thx for the link to that ishkur, i might do that instead, and then just switch my major to networking/security emphasis...

[Palm3R]

I don't claim to be some hacker that can get anyones accounts on anything and destroy their computer and act like a hardass just to be a dick, but if someone pisses me off enough, I'll get their MySpace (since everyone values it so much) or an MSN or yahoo or something like that. or if they piss me off and it's really that serious, I'll just kick their ass.

but the point is, I'm not like most people who just say "oh, I'm gonna hack their account" for no reason to. usually people who say that have no idea what they're talking about anyways...

[Twisted420]

Hmmmmz, Im gonna hack someones myspace for no reason at all...

and yeh mass i agree ;) i say we give it to pie...(is he still here?)

[pureflipper]

ish i could sware i saw this on a wiki page

[Palm3R]

In a security context, a hacker is someone involved in computer security/insecurity, specializing in the discovery of exploits in systems (for exploitation or prevention), or in obtaining or preventing unauthorized access to systems through skills, tactics and detailed knowledge. In the most common general form of this usage, "hacker" refers to a black-hat hacker (a malicious or criminal hacker). There are also ethical hackers (more commonly referred to as white hats), and those more ethically ambiguous (grey hats). To disambiguate the term hacker, often cracker is used instead, referring either to computer security hacker culture as a whole to demarcate it from the academic hacker culture (such as by Eric S. Raymond[1]) or specifically to make a distinction within the computer security context between black-hat hackers and the more ethically positive hackers (commonly known as the white-hat hackers). The context of computer security hacking forms a subculture which is often referred to as the network hacker subculture or simply the computer underground. According to its adherents, cultural values center around the idea of creative and extraordinary computer usage. Proponents claim to be motivated by artistic and political ends, but are often unconcerned about the use of criminal means to achieve them.
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_(computer_security))

no, my message is NOT too short...

[IMRICKJAMESBITCH]

:)i just joined up with this site im currently 17 and i was wanting find out if one you guys could teach me how to hack plz dont make fun of me its not my fault that i have such a passion 4 technology and wont to explore every aspect of it. so if anybody is willing 2 id be thankful so if you want to contact me my myspace is myspace.com/battosai_911 and i also have a vampire freaks acount its kotske_krieg

[clown1337]

I can think whatever I want about anyone I want, and the wonder of the Internet is that I can say it as well. A skiddy is always a skiddy, no matter what, so you're not going anywhere. As for the term to describe you... lemme think about that one for a bit.


lool!! NICE ONE!!!

[Twisted420]

Clown, shuddup your a noob

i just joined up with this site im currently 17 and i was wanting find out if one you guys could teach me how to hack plz dont make fun of me its not my fault that i have such a passion 4 technology and wont to explore every aspect of it. so if anybody is willing 2 id be thankful so if you want to contact me my myspace is myspace.com/battosai_911 and i also have a vampire freaks acount its kotske_krieg

Dude seriously? We've had like 30 threads where we've answered the question: "If i want to learn how to hack, what do i start learning?"

So utfse(local)

[ishkur88]

The noob that says he saw what I said on a Wiki page, Find it. You wont, I assure you.

Now, for the jackass that wants to 'learn how to hack'. Here's a snippet of advice:

You'll never be a hacker.

So, that fact aside, why do you want to be a 'hacker' ?

[Mr Minister]

I don't care what Wiki and 90% of the internet says. To me a hacker is what you guys are calling a cracker and a cracker is a game/program cracker. In the BBS days you had sites that where P/H/A/C (really really gay labeling, but the H was hacking) , hacker groups were Cult of the Dead Cow types, while Cult was around as well (15-20 years ago). Crackers where groups like iNC, Razor 1911, THG, Fairlight,etc.

10 years from now there will be some college fuck saying something about phreakers, "They are often mislabbled, but phreaker means someone knowledgeable with phone systems, people who use them for illegal purposes are "phuckers") or some other shit.

Hacker = guy that knows his shit and breaks into others system without their consent

Security Specialist = long hair gook that snitched on Kevin Mitnick (Kev is a toolbag anyhow and it should have been "FEED KEVIN" with all the fucking begging but still)= love to be called hacker but don't have the balls to do shit without permission.

[Twisted420]

Die. Just Die.

[ishkur88]

Good for you, I hope that definition gets you somewhere in life.... actually I dont, but all things equal you're not better than a racist.

[Mr Minister]

It's funny you should mention that I was just pondering the meaning of a racist the other night and I might have to agree. I do prejudge people at times because of their race.

[Mr Minister]

Die. Just Die.

Kid...relax. Everytime you eat a meal you need to lay on your stomach for half an hour to digest it, otherwise if you stand up to quick the food will fall out your ass, fag.

Shut your cockhole.

[Twisted420]

Don't double post you fuckhead. Try consolidating it into one post in order to keep the forums clean...

Everytime you eat a meal you need to lay on your stomach for half an hour to digest it, otherwise if you stand up to quick the food will fall out your ass, fag.
What in the hell are you trying to imply?

Why do I need to relax? I'm already relaxed, but that doesnt change the fact that I think you should die. We make an attempt to show most of the noobs the difference between a hacker and a cracker, and you make an attempt to destroy any progress we've had the good fortune of making...

[CHEETZzz]

I agree with Ish/Mass
cuz they're right, duh

and lmao @ that kid who said exactly what ish and people said n00bs say. :D

I'm hope to teach myself computer languages, i want to start with Python because that seems to be a good place to start.

Thanks for all the good links guys, you all make it easy but most of the people don't even read the threads, they just ask "howz d03z i h4x?"

What would you recommend as for a language order?
I'm planning on:
Python
XHTML
PHP
C/C++ [at school when it starts]
Java
PERL

Should i revise that list at all? Since i'm taking C/C++ at school i wanted to learn 1-2 languages over this summer.

Thanks in advance yo

[Jerry_yrreJ]

please spam, send virus and other...
3476936098

Tommy_B.C.rich@hotmail.it

[ishkur88]

learn C/C++

[Jakalak]

Where is a good place to start learning how to script? Right now I'm trying to learn how to do game programming through a book, with BlitzMax.

[rdgbmx22]

haha lol major necro ?? i think so =P

[Jakalak]

haha lol major necro ?? i think so =P

lololololol I kno right?! Oh Em Ge! It's not like it's a sticky or anything, couldn't be that at all! And of course, if I were to want an honest answer to a question, god forbid I ask, right?

[deathlord888]

Where is a good place to start learning how to script? Right now I'm trying to learn how to do game programming through a book, with BlitzMax.

lol learn to program before you learn to make anything complex or you will just get dissapointed

[Jakalak]

Can you tell me a pretty easy programming language then? I've tried a couple, but my memory has been too weak for me to do well in it. Any simple ones?

[Twisted420]

Not really. PHP is a pretty simple language, but if you can't retain the information you get, there's no point in trying to do it anyway....

[DoG MikkyW]

Hmmm, the way I started was not in a programming language, but by editing and then learning a markup language. Here's the progression that's worked quite well for me.
HTML --> CSS --> C++ --> Java and C (Kind of simultaneously) --> Now I'm kind of looking to expand into SQL, PHP, and maybe Lisp.

[Leezpo]

No. You aren't. and you suck. fuck you cognito bitch.

Praise teh lord

-Mudkipz

[Twisted420]

Names Lamar, how many times does you tweakin' dumb ass gotta be reminded?

PS: I'm just in one of those moods tonight....

:D

[Twisted420]

Lamar **** << There you go. Now just figure out what the asterisks are....

[jadler]

I

hate

noobs (or as you write, script kiddies)

Awesome post, needed to be said that there is a true form of great computer genius still alive in this world. That putting porno on a PSP does NOT EVER qualify as a "hack". That HTML is a used condom compared to building your own OS in C++. That people should stop asking others for stupid myspace scripts in order to place kittens on the center of their secondary pages.

Fuck.... *takes deep breath* I feel better now.

[GhostExodus]

The definition has changed over the years, i need not explain this part at all.
Hackers generally (in most cases) have an ego and will debate me on this because most of them forget that to become a computer hacker one must first be a skid, skiddie, newb, its all the same, script kiddie.

If you know how to get around common security features in basically anything whether it be getting arround annoying copy rights, reverse engineering programs, exploiting code, programming, tweaking your car in a mannor not sold on the market, making your go card drive faster by attaching rockets to the side, its all the same. Its finding, then getting around security features. heh...

[_Slipknot]

lol.........

[GhostExodus]

Slipknot has been following my posts heh... learning?

[Truant]

o.0 I'm not a hacker, and that doesnt say i am one...though i am also not a "cracker"...

I just know what the difference is...though my only intent on computers is to explore and learn...i've just got this thing where i love to learn about computers, and technology period...

and being a script kiddie doesnt classify as a subspecies of a cracker, its a subspecies of hackers as well, and so i classify myself as a script kiddie who's slowly turning into a hacker...given a long time...

o, and ishkur, you shouldnt classify people when you know so little about them...im not quite sure what to call me personally, but ask mass, he knows me best out of everyone here...so mayb he would have the correct term...

I myself am learning Objective-C, C, C++, Python, Perl, Java, and soon LISP. I intend to be a hacker, and am writing lots of code. 32768-bit encryption is on its way. I classify myself as "scripter", for now. I am learning, but becoming a hacker is a ten-year project, at least. Don't classify a learning hacker as a cracker. It is an insult.

When I started reading this thread, I thought, "Well, at last a person who knows their stuff!". Now, I wonder at the brazenness that made you say something completely unfounded.

Forgiven, if not forgotten, upon apology.

[DoG MikkyW]

I myself am learning Objective-C, C, C++, Python, Perl, Java, and soon LISP. I intend to be a hacker, and am writing lots of code. 32768-bit encryption is on its way. I classify myself as "scripter", for now. I am learning, but becoming a hacker is a ten-year project, at least. Don't classify a learning hacker as a cracker. It is an insult.

When I started reading this thread, I thought, "Well, at last a person who knows their stuff!". Now, I wonder at the brazenness that made you say something completely unfounded.

Forgiven, if not forgotten, upon apology.

Hmmm. Cool, I like this kid, all you need is a few dozen more substantial posts under your belt, I like this opinion though.

[Truant]

What does more major posts have to do with anything?

[DoG MikkyW]

It proves a few things.
1) You're knowledgeable in more than a few select subjects.
2) You're here to stay.
3) And more people see you, so when you do post something iffy, you don't get your ass blown off with comments.

[Truant]

Understood. I intend to be here for a long time, but I can't be sure.

[jadler]

Props to Truant for dedication. Most people act like computer genius is natural talent. They don't understand that it has roots in many branches of science and technology. Learning code is only half of the battle to true mastery. Read things about philosophy, history (such as the 70's version of the cookbook), and frequent forums daily or weekly.

I tend to live by a simple set of rules. If its being done somewhere, go there and learn it. If you find something that's already been made, use it instead of rebuilding it. This way you become a master without needing to learn 100% of the process. When the difference is a few months of self teaching, 98% is better than 100% understanding. People can fill you in on what you miss. Just be sure to avoid the trap of taking easy shortcuts like a noob would do. It gets tempting, but you learn very little that way.

[DoG MikkyW]

jadler, you were just completely wrong for so many reasons. AKA, the cookbook reference, thinking that we cared about your philosophy. Also you just said that you were a skiddy, and you preferred not to learn, if given the option, you just vouched that you are exactly what a hacker is not. Then, you rebuked what you said, and said that you shouldn't take shortcuts.