china arming terrorists.

[puppetmaster]

It appears that China is selling arms to terrorists in Iraq and Afganistan. I think it is time to start playing hardball with China!! The USA is the big marketplace for China. We should start exercising our muscles in the trade arena.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/inring.htm

China arming terrorists
New intelligence reveals China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan, through Iran.
U.S. government appeals to China to check some of the arms shipments in advance were met with stonewalling by Beijing, which insisted it knew nothing about the shipments and asked for additional intelligence on the transfers. The ploy has been used in the past by China to hide its arms-proliferation activities from the United States, according to U.S. officials with access to the intelligence reports.
Some arms were sent by aircraft directly from Chinese factories to Afghanistan and included large-caliber sniper rifles, millions of rounds of ammunition, rocket-propelled grenades and components for roadside bombs, as well as other small arms.
The Washington Times reported June 5 that Chinese-made HN-5 anti-aircraft missiles were being used by the Taliban. .....

[BlackZodiac]

This one is a little odd, take a look at this.

"U.S. officials have openly criticized Iran for the arms transfers but so far there has been no mention that China is a main supplier."

It seems like the United States officials are just blaming Iran for the weapons delivered, but who really knows because there have been many counter terrorism training scenarios...

Good thread, good read.

[puppetmaster]

Well America doesn't want a war wit China, think about it China produces most of what is sold in America, plus they have a billion people. the result of war with China would be bad and no one wants to wake the sleeping dragon.

[BlackZodiac]

Well America doesn't want a war wit China, think about it China produces most of what is sold in America, plus they have a billion people. the result of war with China would be bad and no one wants to wake the sleeping dragon.

Well of course the United States wouldn't want a war with China even if it was alone... North Korea would back the Chinese along with Vietnamese, and Russia is China's 1st top ally. But even without Russia, Vietnam and North Korea, China would take out 60-75% of the United States military. Then would come the economic problems after the war with China... But if the United States went to war with China, you could expect the North koreans and Vietnamese fighting for them, and possibly the Russians.

[Cuddles]

Well of course the United States wouldn't want a war with China even if it was alone... North Korea would back the Chinese along with Vietnamese, and Russia is China's 1st top ally. But even without Russia, Vietnam and North Korea, China would take out 60-75% of the United States military. Then would come the economic problems after the war with China... But if the United States went to war with China, you could expect the North koreans and Vietnamese fighting for them, and possibly the Russians.

urrm....china has the largest freestanding military, as well, they're very well trained (from about the age of 5 usually), we CANT kill them fast enough if we send every force we have, the ONLY way we'd ever win against china today is if we sent nuclear arms, and there're these treaties that people have signed saying we wont do that unless someone does it to us....the US would lose against china, and that's a very good reason they've not been messed with....

[puppetmaster]

I just find this interesting seeing as how Bush claims to be a crusader and yet he diverts the truth of our enemy to a pawn we can most likely defeat (Iran).

[BlackZodiac]

urrm....china has the largest freestanding military, as well, they're very well trained (from about the age of 5 usually), we CANT kill them fast enough if we send every force we have, the ONLY way we'd ever win against china today is if we sent nuclear arms, and there're these treaties that people have signed saying we wont do that unless someone does it to us....the US would lose against china, and that's a very good reason they've not been messed with....

China has the most military personnel in the world, they are slowly letting go 500,000 military personnel because lack of funding. China's military personnel training is not that advanced. They are strong in numbers, they have alot of weapons and tanks, jets, etc. There are much more countries that have better trained military then China, and most of them have never seen battle, which comes in to a good factor.

But you have to take it into consideration, that the United States will use their Navy against China, (China dose not have such a powerful navy) when compared to the United States. China could hold it's own that is for sure.

[Cuddles]

China has the most military personnel in the world, they are slowly letting go 500,000 military personnel because lack of funding. China's military personnel training is not that advanced. They are strong in numbers, they have alot of weapons and tanks, jets, etc. There are much more countries that have better trained military then China, and most of them have never seen battle, which comes in to a good factor.

i didnt mean their training was advanced, i meant they're well trained....

[BlackZodiac]

i didnt mean their training was advanced, i meant they're well trained....

lol, the Iraqi military in the first gulf war were well trained, due to the lacking Iraqi Navy, they could not take out the opposing cruise missiles from the United States Navy... The USMC never got in any war, the actual war lasted some 30 hours (After being bombed from the United States Navy sitting in the Persian Gulf).

[Cuddles]

lol, the Iraqi military in the first gulf war were well trained, due to the lacking Iraqi Navy, they could not take out the opposing cruise missiles from the United States Navy... The USMC never got in any war, the actual war lasted some 30 hours (After being bombed from the United States Navy sitting in the Persian Gulf).

yeah, but china has decent supplies of weaponry, and there're A LOT more of them....plus, think about how much a country's army grows when you enact a draft....the chinese(most of them) consider it an honour to fight when asked by their country, they enact a draft, and you've got most of the male population in the army in just a couple nights, there's no possible way we could beat them, we'd have a hard enough time beating their army as it is now....the only real way we'd win is if they couldnt supply their troops with food, and we managed to keep them going till most of them starved to death, which is a likely thing to have happen, IF we can survive that long....i think that china, if pushed, could produce a lot more agriculture than they already do, tho, so i wouldnt count on that to win....

[BlackZodiac]

yeah, but china has decent supplies of weaponry, and there're A LOT more of them....plus, think about how much a country's army grows when you enact a draft....the chinese(most of them) consider it an honour to fight when asked by their country, they enact a draft, and you've got most of the male population in the army in just a couple nights, there's no possible way we could beat them, we'd have a hard enough time beating their army as it is now....the only real way we'd win is if they couldnt supply their troops with food, and we managed to keep them going till most of them starved to death, which is a likely thing to have happen, IF we can survive that long....i think that china, if pushed, could produce a lot more agriculture than they already do, tho, so i wouldnt count on that to win....

So did Iraq, such as the.
- AH 1 Cobra Attack Helicopters
- T-72's
- RPG-7's and other variants...

You don't understand that every major city is on the coastline of China, therefore striking the coast of China will make it very hard for them to fight and survive such attacks led by the United States. The thing is, eventually the United States would have to move in. And that is where things will turn around.

[BlackZodiac]

Oh yes one more thing, more then 75% of those "Decent supplies" come from Russia and that is only base model Russian equipment, but China dose not have a defence like Russia... China is all offencive, like the United States.

[puppetmaster]

The reason for me thinking that the U.S. wouldn't win is like you said b4 Russia has the technology and may team up with china who has the men (1/6 of the worlds population).

[BlackZodiac]

The reason for me thinking that the U.S. wouldn't win is like you said b4 Russia has the technology and may team up with china who has the men (1/6 of the worlds population).

Yeah, that is true. But let's hope the Russians,China or the United states don't get into a war. Europe,China,Russia and North America should be the ones joinning togeather being the "Super power" that "Police" the world.

[puppetmaster]

Yes i agree but with China supplying terrorism i doubt it will happen.

[BlackZodiac]

Yeah, but check this out while we are talking about Russian equipment.

Russian T-90
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY6NqPd8nz8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5F7GZ7Efxs

(Good overview on the T-90)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGa4Sy2xzSE

Russian military video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAdORW_1Ync (MUST SEE)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRO_mIVHhB0

Russian MRLS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx1jfxtU-HQ (Good video)

[puppetmaster]

If America is full of pussies you'd be one of them ,while america's not the greatest try living in Ethiopia, if you hate this country so much why don't you get the fuck out.
Now im not being hostile just telling you what i think but i do agree with you that Bush is a pussy and amongst other things a horrible leader. The truth is though that i would like you to go to the roughest neighborhood you know of, get out of your car and with no weapons yell fuck niggers (yes im stereotyping black people so fucking what) see what happens to you, all those gangsta's in da hood are fucking Americans just like you.

Of course American gov't is nothing but a bully, if thats what you meant then i Agree but to say Americans are pussies in general is ignorant my friend.

[superflysuperwhite]

china could kayak over and still fuck us up pretty bad

[puppetmaster]

Well its always been said that china could form men 10 miles wide and 10 miles deep for 10 years (exaggeration but still shows the sheer manpower they have, and what is our gov't gonna do, what any coward would do blame a weaker country.

[BlackZodiac]

Yes i agree but with China supplying terrorism i doubt it will happen.

I think you're getting things a little mixed up... China is with the "War on terrorism", what's happening is that the Chinese government is supplying Middle Eastern countries such as Pakistan, India, Iran, Lebanon with these weapons, for money that get funneled into terrorist hands. The weapons are getting passed down the lines, not handed to terrorists...

That would be saying Russia is supporting terrorism, just after they were fighting Mujahideen, Jihadists, Al-Qaeda, and other islamic militant groups in Chechnya... They only sell weapons to other military stable countries for money, and whatever happens to those weapons when it's out of their hands, it's not their problem.

[puppetmaster]

Well the washington post reported China was covertly supplying talaiban with weapons, using Iran as a medium.

[BlackZodiac]

Well the washington post reported China was covertly supplying talaiban with weapons, using Iran as a medium.

"China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan, through Iran.
U.S. government appeals to China to check some of the arms shipments in advance were met with stonewalling by Beijing, which insisted it knew nothing about the shipments and asked for additional intelligence on the transfers."

You failed to refer to "small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan, through Iran". Through Iran is the "topic" here we are talking about, they sold weapons to Iran, who sold it to insurgents. It is out of China's hands when the Iranians sold weapons to the insurgents, China was probably trying to make some profit... Who knows, but you do know China is a Communist state right? The military runs everything, when you say China you are "referring" to the China's military not so the government of Beijing. The army of China is equal to the government if not more, the military of China who made and distributed these weapons didn't have to go through government approval unlike the United States, Canada, Britian, etc. There is no hard evidence that "China handed weapons to terrorists" if that was the case then this would be much of a bigger deal.

China is not aiding insurgents, Chinese military is making money off Iran who sold the weapons to insurgents. If China was aiding the insurgents, the Western powers would boycott Chinese goods or have some other "punishment".

Read this part carefully...
"China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan, through Iran."
-China is not saying "here take this to beat the Western powers in the Middle East", the military is making a bundle off of Iran which so is selling to insurgents.
-The news is spicing this topic up a little and not being totally specific, just to give a more interesting read.
-China and the Chinese military are for the war on terrorism, it just so happens the military is making money off of Iran, it's not like the United States never supported terrorists (They did, in Afghanistan against the Soviets).

[puppetmaster]

Yes but this leads you to believe that China is only using Iran as a cover.

"China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan.
this part would directly indicate that China already knows were the weapons are
going.

[BlackZodiac]

Yes but this leads you to believe that China is only using Iran as a cover.

"China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan.
this part would directly indicate that China already knows were the weapons are
going.

It doesn’t really lead anywhere, but I understand what you are trying to get to. There is no reason for China to support terrorism because China needs allot of money, and by screwing up the ties with the Western powers would be devastating for China and its economy. It doesn’t take a brainiac to know if you sell weapons (Small arms) to a country that is surrounded by terrorist supporting countries that it will end up in terrorist hands.

"U.S. officials have openly criticized Iran for the arms transfers but so far there has been no mention that China is a main supplier."

You do know that there are alot of replica weapons built in Iran, I hope you do when discussing about this topic...

The Chinese military know whare these weapons are going to end up and they got paid, you can't sew a gun store dealer for selling weapons to a "legit" buyer, but in some cases when you're talking about $500,000,000+ worth of weapons then it's worth selling.

[BlackZodiac]

Yes but this leads you to believe that China is only using Iran as a cover.

"China is covertly supplying large quantities of small arms and weapons to insurgents in Iraq and the Taliban militia in Afghanistan.
this part would directly indicate that China already knows were the weapons are
going.

Covertly yes, they don't have to tell the United States they are selling weapons to Iran? Atleast it's not scuds, SLBM's or nuclear missiles... Pfft, the Chinese military wouldn't tell the United States even if they asked, but maybe the Chinese government.

[AnarchistCooker]

China is a pathetic Dump.
Not even good to say they are Socialist let alone Communists.
The Chinese are not Supplying the Terrorists, and even if they were, who gives a fuck? No one exept those damn Republicans. Now anyway back to my point. The Chinese use old Soviet Guns, for example the PPSH (New Edition), AK-47/74, and the Sniper Mosin Nagant. The terrorists could not get supplies from the Chinese, first of all because the 'Socialist' Government does not allow Religion, which is what they are trying to create the world into a damn Religion. Another thing, they got most of their guns off the Black Market, and the Soviet-Afghan War. You are getting Hypnotised by the System my friend.

[BlackZodiac]

China is a pathetic Dump.
Not even good to say they are Socialist let alone Communists.
The Chinese are not Supplying the Terrorists, and even if they were, who gives a fuck? No one exept those damn Republicans. Now anyway back to my point. The Chinese use old Soviet Guns, for example the PPSH (New Edition), AK-47/74, and the Sniper Mosin Nagant. The terrorists could not get supplies from the Chinese, first of all because the 'Socialist' Government does not allow Religion, which is what they are trying to create the world into a damn Religion. Another thing, they got most of their guns off the Black Market, and the Soviet-Afghan War. You are getting Hypnotised by the System my friend.

Once again, you have no fucking clue to what you're talking about in this post, the Chinese military dose not use the PPSH!!! The standard weapon is the QBZ-95!!! Made in the 90's not like the M16 in the 60's...

Check out the 5th Generation multi-purpose fighter the J-10, equivalent to the F-22 Raptor.

The don't use a Mosin Nagant either, they use the QBU-88 (Type-88) sniper rifle...

Next time before you post something stupid like this, post facts.

[AnarchistCooker]

No you idiot. -.-

The Chinese give out old weapons, for example out of date shit. The terrorists cannot afford the shit. Also, I've studied the Chinese alot more then you my friend, spent a whole year studying, Not American Propaganda Bullshit. You need to learn your facts away from Wikipedia my friend. Wikipedia is almost NEVER accurate, because people go on it half the time and say: OMG DES GUIS R COMMIES LOL @ THEM SO YAH DUNT REAAD BOUT THEM KK?

[BlackZodiac]

No you idiot. -.-

The Chinese give out old weapons, for example out of date shit. The terrorists cannot afford the shit. Also, I've studied the Chinese alot more then you my friend, spent a whole year studying, Not American Propaganda Bullshit. You need to learn your facts away from Wikipedia my friend. Wikipedia is almost NEVER accurate, because people go on it half the time and say: OMG DES GUIS R COMMIES LOL @ THEM SO YAH DUNT REAAD BOUT THEM KK?

You're a fucking idoit.

"The Chinese use old Soviet Guns, for example the PPSH (New Edition), AK-47/74, and the Sniper Mosin Nagant."

They do not use those outdated weapons.

"The Chinese give out old weapons, for example out of date shit. The terrorists cannot afford the shit."
-Terrorist cannot afford "the shit" you have no fucking clue to what Osama Bin Ladden had done, rebuilt alot of Aghanistan with his own construction company, you have no clue what and how much money there is involved in wars.

"Also, I've studied the Chinese alot more then you my friend, spent a whole year studying, Not American Propaganda Bullshit."
-I know much more about anything in military then you, pathetic little cunt. What did you study if I may ask?

"You need to learn your facts away from Wikipedia my friend. Wikipedia is almost NEVER accurate, because people go on it half the time and say: OMG DES GUIS R COMMIES LOL @ THEM SO YAH DUNT REAAD BOUT THEM KK?"
- Me? Where did I counter your posts with Wikipedia? You can find the same facts for anything that I have posted on other sources, so get your facts straight, post something that makes sence to what you are trying to counter, and I need proof to the Chinese giving out old outdated weapons, China deals any type of arms for any type of price, your previous post did not state that, get your shit straight little boy.

"The Chinese use old Soviet Guns, for example the PPSH (New Edition), AK-47/74, and the Sniper Mosin Nagant."

Fucking moron, they do not use those weapons, take another quick look to what I was replying to.

Take a look at these Mosin Nagin;)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/5086416.stm
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1571/is_26_16/ai_63583826
http://www.tamilguardian.com/article.asp?articleid=1263

And when you look at these websites, look at the gun names and do some research on them.;)