Are we free?

[methtownblue]

I have thought of this question for a while, and I can't come to a conclusion.

People say that we have free will, but you got to also consider the laws of physics. Things like Choas Theory can also be considered. Just think about it, if every action was carefully replicated, we could easily have duplicates of ourselves and the celestial bodies around us in a parallel universe.

You could have the entire history of Earth planned out from the beginning, even with how animals evolve.

Who knows, there might be copies of me typing this as we speak.

What do you think about this? (I was hoping to add more to this to state the question more clearly, but it didn't go as I planned. Oh well.)

[exial]

I have pondered this also, and i believe the only way you can truly be free is too mentally set yourself free. And no i dont believe we are free, we are living in a world where freedom is an empty word. An illusion.. To be free, that means to be free from all outside influences, such as media, money, and material. To be able to make choices without the thought of consequence. That is free.. i wish i truly knew what is feels like to be free...

[a2thae]

Just think about it, if every action was carefully replicated, we could easily have duplicates of ourselves and the celestial bodies around us in a parallel universe.

You could have the entire history of Earth planned out from the beginning, even with how animals evolve.

Who knows, there might be copies of me typing this as we speak.


There is a theory about this, except that they don't exist in a parallel universe, they exist in the same universe and there are an infinite number of earths. Hitler could be alive right now in one, except named janice or some shit.

They are called o-regions or something like that, it's been awhile...I thought it was interesting.

----------------------------

I believe freedom is about self gain in a philosophical sense.

"Free" is such a loose term, and is interpretted as such. While you can be free in some sense, you can't be free in another...Or can we?

No, not in this state at least.

I propose that death is the ultimate freedom, no longer do you need anything, you just have the experience of the moment which would be quite difficult to comprehend now. Maybe there would be no sensation. Now, I'm not exactly saying there is anything after death...I'm agnostic.

I'm saying that there has to be something right before death. Not a different dimension or a new plane of existence, just an unreal level of consciousness that can only be achieved when you are free of everything.

I've twiddled around with that theory, but I've come to the conclusion it'd only be for self gain because you would either be blatantly bullshitting yourself, or you still would be unable to pass on any knowledge you obtained or any experience.

I then came to the conclusion that freedom is all about self gain. You can argue that self gain is thirst of power. A thirst for power can be interpretted as subliminal. As such freedom is subliminal.

Where the fuck was I going with this...oh yeah, we aren't free, but i believe we can become free and it is something one can strive for, but we all end up experiencing it at one point.

[freetibet]

I think we're free to an extent

Really the only restrictions we have are physical restrictions. Government too can put restrictions on us, but we don't have to have those restrictions.

Really the only thing capable of forcing us into something is God. And God, in my opinion is more concerned with our spiritual well being than our physical well being; and god isn't about to force us to be spiritual.

That said, people often put restrictions on themselves. They tie themselves to earthly things and are incapable of being truly free. They become so interested in physical things,they become slaves to them.

[a2thae]

I think we're free to an extent

Really the only restrictions we have are physical restrictions. Government too can put restrictions on us, but we don't have to have those restrictions.

Really the only thing capable of forcing us into something is God. And God, in my opinion is more concerned with our spiritual well being than our physical well being; and god isn't about to force us to be spiritual.

That said, people often put restrictions on themselves. They tie themselves to earthly things and are incapable of being truly free. They become so interested in physical things,they become slaves to them.

Death is the ultimate freedom.

[freetibet]

Death is the ultimate freedom.

well that would depend mostly on the life you lived...

I really doubt evil people enjoy the post-death experience all that much.

[LordSkweegie]

are we really free though, or do we just have an illusion of freedom?

[a2thae]

well that would depend mostly on the life you lived...

I really doubt evil people enjoy the post-death experience all that much.

Not really. Once you are dead, you are free. Well as you die, and once you are on the brink of death and taking your last breath of air, then you are free. Doesn't have shit to do with the way you lived your life.

I never said anything about there being anything after death. If you are not sentient are you free?

[exial]

I also believe that once we die, we are free. We let go of all earthbound problems and ideals. Our body frees itself from its personality, and we go beyond sleep into something more deep..

[JohnLennonII]

Free: Not controlled by obligation or the will of another.
No. We are always affected in ways we have no control over by other people, especially governments.
Free: Having political independence.
In America, more or less. It's debatable.
Free: Not subject to external restraint.
No. I can't fly just 'cause I think I have wings.
Free: Given, made, or done of one's own accord; voluntary or spontaneous.
In most things yes, in some things no. According to this definition we are mostly free.
But then it's like, "He's only mostly dead..."

In terms of free will, in those things which we have control we are free to do as we please.
Things outside of our control we are not.
Life is figuring out which one's those are and using them to the max.
Once we are dead, we may be free, but based on the lack of any real evidence for what happens after the grave, it's all just conjecture and personal opinion.

[TroubleMaker]

So long as we live in a society there are rules that we follow, whether consciously or otherwise.

One can only ever be truly free when one is competely alone.

[methtownblue]

Seems a lot of people didn't understand what I was getting at.

I'm not talking about "free" like laws or whatever. I'm trying to ask whether the actions we do are free will, or something thats just a product of chaos theory, thereby making even us as humans predictable and not free.

[TroubleMaker]

Yeah I know what you meant. Society dictates how we behave. For example, you could jump on a table in a resteraunt and start dancing, but you probably wouldn't.
This is because of a mental blockade formed from years of living within a particualr society.
We behave appropriately at any particular time, lest we be carted off to a mental asylum.

[DollShank]

I don't think we are free. I think paths are set out for us to follow based on who we are and how we live. I really don't know how to word this any differently.

[a2thae]

Seems a lot of people didn't understand what I was getting at.

I'm not talking about "free" like laws or whatever. I'm trying to ask whether the actions we do are free will, or something thats just a product of chaos theory, thereby making even us as humans predictable and not free.

Yeah I know what you meant. Society dictates how we behave. For example, you could jump on a table in a resteraunt and start dancing, but you probably wouldn't.
This is because of a mental blockade formed from years of living within a particualr society.
We behave appropriately at any particular time, lest we be carted off to a mental asylum.

I don't think he was getting at that, he was talking about things being deterministic, but i don't think that it interferes with "free" in that sense...

[TroubleMaker]

My bad. He talking about fate, or something like that?

[methtownblue]

In a way, yes. But I'm talking about fate as a science, not of faith.

[mccoy42779]

ya i've been carted off to a mental asylum a few times for being myself. I'm not crazy like i don't comprehend what im doing. Being locked up in a asylum for too long will make u crazy!

[mccoy42779]

freedom in a sense like, are we a SIMS game to another species

[mccoy42779]

in that sense we have the ability to be free but its very hard. Ive been trying

[methtownblue]

freedom in a sense like, are we a SIMS game to another species

Is that supposed to be a question? I don't see a question mark, so I'm not sure if you are asking.

[AliceinWonderland]

There's no way that freedom can exist in any type of society. Whether it's a government creating the pressure or our peers, as humans, we are eternally subject to being imprisoned within ourselves.

exile and a2thae, the theory you believe about death being the ultimate form of freedom is interesting, are you arguing that death is the only form or freedom or only the truest. i'd love to hear more on your ideology of the topic.

-Alice.

[katt]

...Are there no rules against necroing in this forum, or is everyone just missing them?

[Necron214]

we are consumers so we are slaves to economic,we buy for buying,not survival,i think

[Cashis Clay]

Your girl is free 2 my dick.

[Wolkkkk]

Well i hate doing work. And they are making me. So no im not free.

[AvengedX7]

In many ways yes, in many ways no. Although we are not free in plenty of ways without the freedom to truly do what we want and live peacefully without worries.. i am still very thankful to live in a country where i dont have much on my plate and dont have many worries, and protected (although lied to and manipulated and corrupted) by our government.

So i dont think theres a straight answer

edit:and wat wolkkk said

[gsuphoesdown]

free is defined as "Not controlled by obligation or the will of another" according to thefreedictionary.com. so its pretty obvious that we are not free by definition.

[pntballer5634]

when we are told we have freedom, there's fine print that says
your free, but you will be persecuted for almost everything you can do, and you can't do some things.

[alucard621]

i believe, in america at least, we are not as free as we would like to believe.

mentally, i believe there are many humans who do not have true freedom, their choices greatly affected by their environment. but, those of us who are truly enlightened in the way, be it whichever way we have chosen, are unshackled entities, ready to fuck shit up :P

[ravenscar]

kill the christains, the end

[TotalAnarchyUK]

Learn to spell.

[ravenscar]

what did i misspell?

[Xon]

kill the christains, the end

Fuck you you little prick.

[exial]

ravenscar's a douche.

Freedom is simply a word-ideal. To live with freedom means what? Living free from society? Consequence?

[Xon]

ravenscar is banned....

[exial]

Why is he banned?

[Xon]

Don't know... He just is.

[b_rookey]

I also believe that once we die, we are free. We let go of all earthbound problems and ideals. Our body frees itself from its personality, and we go beyond sleep into something more deep..

others believe that when you die, you dont lose your personality. that personality is not only stored in the brains but in your organs. and when you die you still have your personality, and something called chi, or "inner power". I'm not saying I believe this, I think it's Taoism. But nonetheless, something interesting to think about.

[harshmaster]

mabey we should kill the Christians, get them out of the way and make room for freedom

[Xon]

Maybe you should go fuck yourself.

[harshmaster]

mabey mj will fuck with you:O

[skull]

We still have taxes? Yes. So are we free? No.

[harshmaster]

ya a real thinker not a mindset

[skull]

ya a real thinker not a mindset
That really doesn't make a lot of sense. Please reword it.

[Xon]

harshmaster is just a troll... Leave him be.